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I thought this was a really thought provoking post, Captains Log, “After Lies.” Read it, it’s brief and worthwhile but basically, “What do we do after determining we’re being told lies?“
It’s a really profound question both for us as individuals and collectively as a country.
My snark-o-meter just wants to quip, “Nothing. Those of us determined to never learn usually just repeat the same lessons, over and over and over again.“
Just kidding, but actually that’s very true! As the saying goes, “those of us who DO learn from history are forced to just sit back and watch the others repeat it.”
In an individual situation when you discover a deception, a lie embedded somewhere in your soul, you have to pluck it out and replace it with the truth. Counteract it with reality. Metanoia, repentance, change your mind. “The truth shall set you free.”
Something that I think is very challenging for our country as a whole, the same is true collectively. When we discover we’ve all been lied to, WE have to repent. This is kind of tricky emotionally because we often want to the liars to repent. Right? I didn’t do it, I’m the victim here!
It feels terribly unfair, but it’s not up to the bad guys to change. WE have to repent of whatever caused us to believe the lie in the first place. Sometimes we have to repent for being vulnerable and having been taken advantage of. We may have to repent of having been poor stewards of ourselves. Sometimes we have to repent of having allowed someone unworthy to have authority over us. We might have to repent of placing our trust in the wrong people. We might have to repent of ignoring or disregarding good advice and choosing to believe a lie instead.
Who knows, people are complicated and so it can be an individual laundry list of assorted repentance, a tangled web of lies, one built upon another. Regardless, I’m a firm believer in the idea that there are no victims in heaven.
That’s a spiritual statement, a metaphorical concept, a stance and an attitude, not a condemnation of people who have been victimized.
I’ve repented a few dozen times of what happened and what has continued to happen to some of the people involved in the protests on Jan 6. I’ve repented of being powerless to protect and defend due process, repented of living in a country that has forgotten the importance of truth and justice. An innocent woman was murdered outright. People have been given outrageous prison sentences, and we have all been lied to. The media and politicians deliberately lied to us and they will continue to lie to us until we say no more.
We repent because if you willingly swallow blatant lies long enough there comes a point where you just become complicit with the lie and you are now actively endorsing deception and injustice.
See, there's this thing called biology... 
Reblogged this on Talmidimblogging.
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Thank you, Vincent.
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My pleasure 🙏🏻 ☺
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I think some people desperately want to trust in authorities and experts because it makes life easier. They were told to trust and obey as children and so they still do. Of course being hardheaded, I never received that message to begin with. And it really, really does make life more difficult.
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Good point about how being hardheaded really does make life more difficult. I never got the “trust and obey” message either. It is far easier to just obey and allow yourself to be lulled off into a false sense of security, or at least that’s what I imagine it feels like. Even I will just throw a mask on to run into the grocery store and grab some milk, because who wants to expend all the energy required to make a scene every single time?
Ironically God has never demanded my trust and obedience. He doesn’t need it! However, He has frequently shown me that my own comfort level will be greatly improved if I do trust in Him and obey, since we’re going to be going over the cliff anyway. 🙂
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Yes, we need to trust in God. He doesn’t need the validation. I’ve also come to recognize that there are people who should know more than I do, whose opinions I can trust. Spiritual mentors have been sadly lacking, however. It seems most people feel too inadequate to be that, and now I’m at the age when I should be the mentor. Sort of a different subject from your post. But it has got me thinking about the dearth of yet importance of trustworthy elders in our society.
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Amen, Jill.
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Yeah msb, and these are the same people who are professional liars when it comes to ‘science so called,’
I’m pretty sure God hates that word as it is traded today more than I do.
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Yeah, we’re really in the grip of something emotional or spiritual or both. Some people are just bad to the core, but I know some who just baffle me, because they know enough about science they should be able to easily recognize something is rotten in Denmark, and yet they just can’t or won’t.
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With of course apologies to all great Danes everywhere.
😎
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LOL! No disrespect towards Denmark at all! In fact, I admire them for having the discernment to know when something smells rotten. 🙂
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Btw, did you know the state dog of PA is the great dane?
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I did not know that! We had a great dane over for Christmas. Sweet girl and very comical because she thought she was a lap dog and just did not fit on the furniture.
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To bemoan and cry out for an a**kicking is completely different from actually kicking a**
What to do after lies? Drastic and serious measures
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I’m ready to hang ’em all out to dry, every lying liar and the lie they rode in on! One bit of unfinished business however, is preventing it from ever happening again and to do that you have to somehow educate the masses who have been cheering it on, who refuse to see the truth, who seem to prefer the lies.
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“WE have to repent of whatever caused us to believe the lie in the first place.”
And THAT is the exact TRUTH – the TRUTH that sets us free! (I speak of philosophical ethics)
My atheist father knew that much. His thoughts aligned perfectly with such an acknowledgement. “Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me”.
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Amen, MJ. That “fool me twice, shame on me” is partially about taking responsibility and establishing ownership over any given situation.
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This is an interesting post, IB, and you’ve got me thinking. I don’t suppose many of us repent as much as we ought or as often as we should, but I also don’t see any of us called to repent of someone else’s sin. If someone lied to Jane and Jane believed the lie and responded in good faith, should Jane repent? Of course if her misinformed actions harmed another person, she should repent for that harmful action–but how can Jane repent for someone else’s lie? In fact, I see too much of that going on in the “woke world”–pointing fingers at other people and repenting for their sins instead of examining one’s self and repenting for one’s own sins. Besides, unless repentance leads to the glory of God’s forgiveness, delivered through the cross of Christ, it cannot be genuine repentance. J.
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Well, one huge difference between the woke crowd and our faith, we aren’t necessarily repenting to each other, we’re repenting to God Himself. Repentance is not an apology for our existence, it is submission to God, surrender to His ways perhaps, a willingness to put Him in charge. It is a desire for change, metanoia. We’re shifting leadership from our will over to His.
I think many in the Christian world have reduced “repentance” to something more like an apology, like just saying you’re sorry. “Sin” is now shrunk down to something more akin to a petty crime you allegedly have to apologize for. It’s almost like a superficial transaction or something, an exchange. I think repentance is far more profound than that and hardly ever involves other people at all. If I stomp on someone’s foot I’m certainly not going to “repent” to them. That’s in the realm of saying you’re sorry…. or not.
I also don’t think repentance requires a specific sin or fault or blame. I know someone who repented of her father getting cancer and abandoning her. Obviously she didn’t have a hand in any of that, but give it to God anyway, and let Him sort it all out.
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Jesus called upon people to “repent and believe,” and the context of that teaching was that we turn away from our old sinful lives and embrace the new life that comes from God. Clearly that turning is far deeper than an apology, but it still acknowledges that one is wrong and needs to change. I do not believe that a person can repent once and be done repenting; I believe that the life of a Christian in this world is a life of constant repentance. I also do not believe that any of us can repent (or believe) without God’s help. We were dead in sin; he has made us alive in Christ. Jesus tells us to repent and believe, but his words enable us to do as he says. (It’s like “take up your bed and walk,” or, “Lazarus, come out” of the tomb.) J.
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Amen, Salvageable. I think we’re on the same page. I like what you said about not being able to repent without God’s help. Also, I think He leads us, first to Himself, and later to any other repentance He wants. He first calls us, just as you’ve said, like Lazarus or the man on the mat.
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The ability to recognise lies and find the source of truth is a skill that needs to be mastered in these days of high tech communications, Murdoch’s news, the conspiracy merchants and social media. It appears a hell of a lot of people were unable to do this so they attacked the American democratic system. A learning curve for all Americans.
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“We the people” ARE the American democratic system, and you are extra dumb if you think that’s what happened.
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LOL!
Quite a ramble, coming from a person (and directed to people) who LITERALLY get their news from an OFFICIAL BULLSHIT ARTIST.
Here is how the Trump appointed judge in a slander suit against Fox [cough] News and Tucker Carlson in 2020 summed up Fox/Carlson’s own defence:
For the hearing impaired, the judge is literally stating that Fox and Carlson do NOTHING BUT LIE, and only COMPLETE IDIOTS wouldn’t know this.
Again, that is the judge’s summation of Tucker Carlson’s OWN DEFENCE presented in court!!
Well done, Inanity… Well done!
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LOL! I think I’m starting to envy the atheists for their blind faith and complete trust in the power of Fox news! Myself, with the exception of a few video clips now and then, have never watched Fox news. Do I even like Tucker Carlson? Heck if know, I couldn’t even pick him out of a line up.
However, I do assure you that it only requires 3 brains cells to realize that Jan 6 was NO insurrection. This is a country with the most heavily armed citizenry in the world! Ashli, the one person who lost her life on Jan 6, wasn’t even armed. If the goal had actually been for the protestors to seize the capital, I promise you, the capital would now be in their possession.
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A few video clips now and then…
LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!
You’re not just excellent at falling for right wing media lies (which they even ADMIT to being nothing but bullshit artists fooling their idiot audiences in court), you’re superb at lying to yourself!!
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Speaking of idiot audiences….
https://greenwald.substack.com/p/a-court-ruled-rachel-maddows-viewers
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I just think it’s hilarious that you have all fallen for (and have devoted yourselves to) the LEAST CHRIST-LIKE MAN to have ever entered US politics…. And do so to the drum beat of a “news” organisation that literally admits it simply lies to its audience because it knows they’re complete idiots.
That’s not me saying that. That’s what your “news” source says about itself and about you, the people who consume its trash.
You evangelicals are just so predictably horrid.
It’s really no mystery why your “EVANGELICAL CHURCH IS BREAKING APART”
https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2021/10/evangelical-trump-christians-politics/620469/
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That news source I had provided is from the progressive left. The Atlantic is a neo-liberal rag, and propaganda wing of the neo-liberals.
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In 2020, your own “news” source openly admitted in a court of law that it peddles nothing but LIES SO OBVIOUS ONLY COMPLETE IDIOTS WOULD EVER BELIEVE THEM.
“Complete idiots”
Sorry, but according to the lawyers for your own “news” source, you, sir, are a complete idiot.
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Not my source, but a left source. I thought a screeching liberal like you would feel at home reading it. But, your political and intellectual dysphoria renders you incapable of reason and discourse. Enjoy your upper case rants in your parents basement, ape.
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I hardly think hyperbole concerning a paid Russian propagandist who actually works and directs the “content” at the trashiest of trash fake news companies, OAN, compares to the organised 24/7 effort to whitewash history being made by a global entertainment network that admits in front of a judge that it peddles nothing but lies to its audience.
But sure, go ahead — believe Fox and OAN, and that former guy, Trump, who told 30,573 recorded lies over four years (averaged out at 21 blatant lies per day)… and they’re just the lies we know about because he said them publically. Zeus only knows what the real number is.
THIRTY THOUSAND, FIVE HUNDRED AND SEVENTY-THREE *KNOWN* LIES IN JUST FOUR YEARS.
There’s an entire Wiki page devoted just to Trump’s lies!
And yeah, the funny part – this is allegedly a post about Liberals lying.
Talk about projection!
You people are so utterly pathetic.
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Oh, my! A real life Russia-gater! lol
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Great to see you trust a guy who lied 30,573 in public.
What do you think the real number of lies he told in those four years is?
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Don’t worry about John, Rob. Poor guy needs to take a walk and chill out, work on lowering his blood pressure.
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Lol!!
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I’m curious, Inanity. If this post is actually about lies, why haven’t you addressed The Big Lie that led to the coup attempt?
Sixty-three times team Trump failed to make a case. Sixty-three times the claim of fraud was laughed out of court for being complete and utter nonsense.
What do you say about The Big Lie that led directly to Babbitt’s death?
Or do you want to simply ignore this awkward part of the real world?
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Hi john, and equally curious, in a world where 5 year old kids can hack computer systems, do you really believe that sir Biden ( who cannot string together 5 words to make a coherent sentence without help) received more LEGITIMATE votes.
Remember, it’s been said, that it matter little who votes, but WHO counts the votes. Talk about manipulation?
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Care to explain then how team Trump lost sixty-three court cases in a row?
Sixty-three.
I’d really like to hear your explanation for this…
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You would not like to “hear” anything Zande, since you are heavily invested in believing the lies.
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Go on Inanity… Explain to me how SIXTY-THREE court cases were lost in a row?
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Go on, Inanity… Explain to me how Trump lost sixty-three court cases in a row.
Explain to me how every re-count (in Republican states, mind you) confirmed the result.
Show me how Trump (and his Big Lie) is not absolutely to blame for Babbitt’s death.
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No?
Can’t do it?
Can’t actually present any evidence?
That’s a shame.
So, you in fact recognise Trump and his Big Lie is wholly responsible for Babbitt’s death.
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Easy. The answer is ‘politics.’
Good people with sober minds have said as much. It’s the same reason Supreme court justices having the same information, arrive at opposite conclusions.
The incomparable deceased Antonio Scalia would agree with us assessment. It’s pointless to cite reams of proof.
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That doesn’t explain anything.
Explain to me how SIXTY-THREE claims of fraud were thrown out of courts across the US because there was no evidence presented.
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Wasn’t my answer about the Justices good enough??
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Errr, no… But you’re providing a simply brilliant real time example of why Trump every single court case.
Care to try again?
[whispers: here is where you present evidence to support the claim…]
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Eh, I’ll pass, but not for a lack of material, but only of continued interest.
But here’s to a smokin good New Years wish for health and prosperity to you/
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Ah, so you don’t have any… you know… evidence?
I see.
Sixty-three judges saw that, too… and ruled accordingly.
And thanks, you too. Hope 2022 is good for everyone.
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BTW
LOL!
You’re citing hyperbole concerning a paid Russian propagandist who actually works at OAN?
Priceless!!!!
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Not that you care, Zande, but it was total lie. ZERO capital hill police officers were killed that day. Only one capital hill cop has ever died in the line of duty and that was Billy Evans on April 2, 2021, and the guy who killed him was associated with the Nation of Islam.
I have no loyalty to Ted Cruz? As you can see, he participated in a lie. At the very least, I think he should resign and take the Liar in Chief with him.
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Right. Officer Sicknick (defending elected members of Congress) wasn’t beaten to death by the seditionist mob.
The terrorist Babbitt (seeking to kill members of your congress and overturn the Constitution of the United States) was a hero.
And of course, this comes from a “news” source which defends itself in court by admitting ONLY COMPLETE IDIOTS WOULD BELIEVE IT’S LIES.
Your own “news source” calls itself a source of OBVIOUS LIES… But you believe it, because, according to Fox’s own lawyers, you’re all complete idiots.
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Zande, Brian Sicknick died of two thromboembolic strokes the day after. An autopsy was performed and it was determined he died of natural causes and was never attacked or assaulted in anyway. He died because two blood clots blocked his arteries. It had nothing to do with Jan 6 at all.
Ashli was a US veteran. If she had intended to “kill members of congress” and “overthrow the Constitution,” she would have known to bring a weapon. She was completely unarmed.
An innocent woman was murdered, Zande, and Sicknick died of natural causes. That’s the truth, easily verifiable. We were lied to, deceived, which is the whole point of this post.
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Fair enough, initial reports were wrong, but I see the coroner also said “all that transpired played a role in his condition.” And no, an innocent woman was not murdered. She was part of a violent attempt to usurp the US Constitution and overthrow democracy.
150+ officers injured… is that a “lie” too, Inanity?
And why do you think the seditionists carried zip ties if not for hostages?
So, it seems your defence is the coup (inspired by The Big Lie) failed due to disorganisation and NOT ENOUGH VIOLENCE… so no harm.
Great defence, Inanity.
But yeah– no wrongdoing, no plot to overthrow democracy, nothing nefarious, which is why NOT ONE person involved will testify under oath like a person who has nothing to hide.
Innocent people don’t cower. Innocent people don’t hide.
This post is about lies, but the people you’re defending are the liars… and cowards, too.
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Ted Cruz is a skeevy little worm. Always has been, no doubt always will be, though I do harbor hope for people to change.
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A bipartisan Senate report found that at least seven people had lost their lives in connection with the Jan. 6 attack.
WASHINGTON — As a pro-Trump protest turned into a violent attack on the Capitol on Jan. 6 last year, four people in the crowd died.
Ashli Babbitt, an Air Force veteran, was fatally shot by a Capitol Police officer as rioters tried to breach the House chamber.
Kevin D. Greeson died of a heart attack, collapsing on the sidewalk west of the Capitol on Jan. 6.
Rosanne Boyland appeared to have been crushed in a stampede of fellow rioters as they surged against the police.
Benjamin Philips, the founder of a pro-Trump website called Trumparoo, died of a stroke.
Mr. Greeson and Mr. Philips died of natural causes, the Washington medical examiner said in April. He added that Ms. Boyland’s death was caused by an accidental overdose.
In the days and weeks after the riot, five police officers who had served at the Capitol on Jan. 6 died.
Officer Brian D. Sicknick of the Capitol Police, who was attacked by the mob, died on Jan. 7.
Officer Jeffrey Smith of the Metropolitan Police Department killed himself after the attack.
Officer Howard S. Liebengood of the Capitol Police also died by suicide four days afterward.
The Capitol Police had previously said that Officer Sicknick died from injuries sustained “while physically engaging with protesters.” The Washington medical examiner later ruled that he had died of natural causes: multiple strokes that occurred hours after Officer Sicknick’s confrontation with the mob. The medical examiner added, however, that “all that transpired played a role in his condition.”
A bipartisan Senate report, released in June, found that the seven deaths were connected to the Capitol attack. But the report was issued a month before two Metropolitan Police officers — Gunther Hashida and Kyle DeFreytag — died by suicide in July.
The police agencies have not classified the four total suicides as “line of duty” deaths that would provide the victims’ families with enhanced benefits. Washington law excludes suicide deaths from the line-of-duty designation.
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It appears Inanity’s position on the attempted coup is that it was not violent enough. Seems she doesn’t care about the 150+ policemen attacked and injured.
She also doesn’t seem to want to address the actual cause of the attempted coup — The Big Lie of election fraud…. thrown out of court sixty-three times.
Odd, considering this post is *apparently* about being lied to.
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Insurrection? Sedition? 725 have been charged in the January 6th riot. Of those charged, a big fat zero have been charged with insurrection or sedition. As Rand Paul said about wearing masks, it’s all theater.
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Right, ZERO charges of sedition or insurrection, they couldn’t even fake those! And what remains of most of the charges is such a gross miscarriage of justice, it’s just tragic to watch. Here on the left coast we’ve had people burning down buildings, looting, and assaulting people repeatedly, and they just walk in the front door of the courthouse and out the back. This is all totally political and has nothing to do with the truth.
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And the sitting VP is quoted as saying about the Wisconsin riots – or as the left calls them – protestors: “they’re not gonna stop before Election Day in November, and they’re not gonna stop after Election Day, and they should not.”
The official Brown Shirts of the authoritarian left of this country – ANTIFA and BLM.
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You nailed it!
Sadly a good chunk of those rioting for the left are serious meth and heroin addicts. I’m not supposed to say that, but many have long track records of drug use, they’re missing teeth, and they’re covered in sores. Flat out, the addicted, mentally ill, and homeless, are simply being exploited and used for political purposes by those in power.
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Are you pro-fascist?
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[coughs politely]
Oath Keepers leader and 10 others charged with ‘seditious conspiracy’ related to US Capitol attack
https://edition.cnn.com/2022/01/13/politics/oathkeeper-rhodes-arrested-doj/index.html
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Errrr… you were saying?
Oath Keepers leader and 10 others charged with ‘seditious conspiracy’ related to US Capitol attack
https://edition.cnn.com/2022/01/13/politics/oathkeeper-rhodes-arrested-doj/index.html
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First thing – if anyone is proven guilty of treason or sedition – lock ’em up for good.
Period. But let’s try Harris for treason, too. She supported those ‘peaceful protests’ in Wisconsin. You, know, the ones that burned buildings to the ground, burned law enforcement vehicles, threw Molotov cocktails into government buildings, and attempted to break into the Capitol building. So, are you interested in filing sedition charges against your VP?
https://federalnewsnetwork.com/government-news/2020/06/crowds-tear-down-statues-attack-wisconsin-state-senator/
https://thefederalist.com/2020/08/31/meet-the-rioting-criminals-kamala-harris-helped-bail-out-of-jail/
If you think I, or anyone here on this blog would provide cover for treason, then you’re insane. But, if you’re going to call out the right, make sure that you’re squeaky clean before you come here to proselytize your CNN talking points.
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Here, for a post *apparently* on lies, an article about the liars –The Republican Party… written by a Republican!
GOP Rep. Adam Kinzinger says Republicans have a ‘truth crisis’
https://www.businessinsider.com/adam-kinzinger-gop-has-a-truth-crisis-got-their-head-in-the-sand-2022-1
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Speaking of lies…from YOUR side…
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Amen. Were we not designed to lie to ourselves, how could a strong sense of self-preservation exist in individuals of a social species?
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