In case no one noticed, I have a dozen concerns about the red pills, ideology I’ve been researching and tracking for a number of years now. Sometimes people ask me why and I can’t even answer properly. Culture, politics, faith?
Way back when, it all began with pick up artistry, puas, and the way they merged into the Mens Rights Movement. No surprise, some people began making a ton of money selling books on how to pick up women, how to game them so to speak.
Our culture obviously has seen some huge shifts in values, the sexual revolution, the fracture of two parent families, absent fathers. How do we learn our ethics, our values, in the absence of any traditional sources? No faith, no family, no church, certainly no healthy examples on TV anymore, and we are simply unrooted, adrift, seeking answers anywhere we can find them.
I hate to see people broken, I hate to see the devastation and destruction they can cause, not just to their own selves but to others too. It’s sad, it’s wasteful. There’s another way, a better way. Life is precious.
So these unrooted, Lost Boys go plunging into the matrix, the red pills, and often find a very appealing message, all entwined in male entitlement, sexual dominance, power and control, anger. That’s very seductive for those who are feeling powerless, but the results can sometimes be destructive and tragic.
Elliot Rodgers and his shooting spree and suicide at University of California at Santa Barbara.
The rape trials of Jason M. Berlin, Jonas Issac Dick, and Alexander Markham Smith, men who actually blogged their “field report.”
There are many more.
Some red pills, those who are Christians, those who claim to follow Jesus Christ, those who quote scripture, I have tried to appeal to, to ask them to lead the way. Dalrock, Vox Day, Donal Graeme, Tomassi and so, so many others. It never goes well, but no matter how many deaf ears my words fall on, we still need all of our Christian men to step up to the plate, to lead the way, to speak life to a dead and dying world. We need truth spoken, not hatred for women, not darkness, not domination as destruction, but life and Light. Love.
I suspect the red pills will now begin to fracture, distance themselves from their darker elements yet again, create another new name, but the ideology, the spirit there is as old as time.
Cast it all aside and speak life, share the gospel, spread the good news. It’s that simple.
See, there's this thing called biology... 
I’m convinced sometimes that it’s not even worth it to try to form relationships with the opposite sex anymore. No matter if you are a man or woman it’s just not worth it. If you can find love then you’ve found a good thing, but it just doesn’t happen very often and stability and security is so hard to come by. It’s a lonely, broken world out there. If i ever separated from my husband I wouldn’t even so much as bother looking for another man. And I can’t have more kids, and no way would I want to in this world. I’m only thankful that I got married so young because it probably saved me from being taken advantage of by those like the PUAs and red-pill types who are looking to live the player lifestyle and “game” lots of young, naive girls. I was married through my late teenage years and early twenties, the ages where we haven’t yet matured fully emotionally, so I was spared that life. It’s such a terrible world out there these days and young girls are left to get taken advantage of by these guys at such young ages when they don’t have a clue about life or men and by the time they wise up and mature they’ve already been used sexually by countless men and probably had a few kids, probably with different fathers, sometimes kids they aren’t even raising, and have already ruined their lives after which point there is no undoing the damage or ever turning back. I just hope I’ve made the slightest difference to the lives of someone out there with all my writings over the years. If i do nothing else in life, at least I hope I’ve made some difference, no matter how small.
These men should be standing up to make a difference, but instead they are exploiting feminism to their advantage and leaving more devestation in their wake that future generations will have to clean up. Shame on them.
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And all for what? So they can say they tricked some naive women or easy women into having sex with them? What purpose does that serve? What value does it really add to their lives? Is it really all worth it in the end? Does it not damage these men in some way as well, I wonder? Casual sex will never damage men to the extent it does women, but it does leave damage nonetheless.
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All sexual immorality does spiritual damage. All abuse and using of other human beings does spiritual damage as people distance themselves from all things good, harden their hearts, and twist truth into lies. And those in that movement show how damaged they are on a regular basis. Their evilsma,e the whole world of men (and masculinism) just as heart breaking and terrifying as feminism has done to the “cause” of good women.
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It’s really tragic, isn’t it?
I think you’ve made a difference with your writing. The more voices we have speaking up about this kind of stuff, the better. And you never know, a miracle could happen. Maybe some of those Christian red pills will come to their senses. 🙂
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I’m not sure they will, IB. From the parts I’ve peeked at I’d say some are clearly not really Christians at all. It’s awful for them to bring shame on the cross like that, but no more so than any other wrong that people bring in claiming it’s Christianity when it’s clearly contradictory to what God actually says in his revealed word. It’s a scriptural concept that wolves will creep in and teach falsely. It is a scriptural concept that some will claim the name of Christ but at the judgement seat be told “depart I know he not.” And it’s a scriptural concept that some depart from God’s ways and prove themselves for what they really are. It’s just as sad that so many are afraid to believe what God tells them about these things and the ways he teaches to help us discern who the wolves are as it is that the wolves are out there inflating their pride and their egos and spreading their false teaching…and it’s all pretty equally sad compared to churches that make the mistakes that are sort of the opposite mistakes and give these guys the foothold to rebel against those feminist wolves. Satan is roving to and fro seeking who he may devour. If he can’t pull you away by feminism in the church then he’ll send in these men pretending to be the antidote to feminism. If that doesn’t work then he’ll tell you how you’re not allowed to ever discern any truth anyway because you have to love people so much that you put their desires above God’s statutes and/or that there are many personal paths but no standard…
We have to keep focusing on those who do love God’s statutes above all these worldly distractions from Truth. Focus on all things virtuous. There are, thankfully, a few good people out there, not perfect people but at least people striving to follow God and own it and fix it when they screw up and need to repent. In a way, I admire you’re willingness to face all that mess. But at the same time I worry for you and the effects of striving after futility.
Tonight I’ve been journaling about the need to be willing to be wronged. I think you have that one down so much better than I do. Although I’ve certainly grown in that from years of abuse and I’m certainly growing in that area nowadays as I try to process it all and not end up crazed or embittered. I don’t know if I’ll ever be in a place to take on another person again who I’ll need to be that willing to love sacrificially even though all us humans are flawed, experienced as I am with men who are quite the opposite of loving or understanding or sacrificial. I might have my hands full from here on out loving my kids sacrificially and trying to heal from all those years of marital abuse. But I do love to at least see a few of them commenting here or seeing several among social circles who are clearly good husbands. It fills me with joy to see those few good ones showing in their daily lives that THERE ARE real men who are also good men. And when it feels as though they are far too rare I can go read Job 31 to remind me that such men do exist.
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“If he can’t pull you away by feminism in the church then he’ll send in these men pretending to be the antidote to feminism. If that doesn’t work then he’ll tell you how you’re not allowed to ever discern any truth anyway because you have to love people so much that you put their desires above God’s statutes and/or that there are many personal paths but no standard… ”
Now ain’t that the truth? That’s really well said! You’ve done a great job of describing what I sometimes call “a perfect confluence of an unholy trinity.”
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IB, I’ve seen some encouraging remarks by Dalrock. I try to post on his blog that there are women who aren’t like the red pillars make us out to be.
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Thanks, Pam. I try to keep my mind open and my heart cautiously optimistic. There’s hope for everyone, even Dalrock. Just the same, even a broken clock can be right twice a day. Red pillians are often rooted in some pretty major dysfunction. It can take a long time to heal that.
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Real men, defined as those who know and live by their created design, are rare. We need more real men to stand up and be counted. Even the church has relegated men to the status of “just be nice”. Highly recommend John Eldridge’s classics, “Wild at Heart” and “Fathered by God”. I tend to agree with Eldridge when he said that people, even women, wonder where all the real men are, “You’ve emasculated them.” We are not created to be “beastly trolls” nor are we created to me “metrosexuals”–but to express that side of God that is not only kind, but a bold warrior! Loved the thoughts!
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Thanks, Pastor Randy. Real men aren’t so rare these days, I see them everywhere, but we have certainly made a mess of things and left so many behind.
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Yes we have IB, looking forward to your next musings…
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Poor, mistaken Grammy, PUAs and MRAs have never shared a common history. MRAs hate PUAs they’ve never been from the same stock.
But then, you don’t know about the Tribes of Game so I’ll enlighten you:
https://therationalmale.com/2013/04/19/the-evolution-of-game/
This comment from Deti in the Evolution of Game was too epic not to make a post of. He leaves out Aunt Giggles Iscariot, the betrayer, but he is forgiven:
THE GENESIS
In the beginning was Game. And the game was with the natural alpha, and the Game was alpha. And the natural alphas created the world of pickup, and they saw that it was good.
And they said, “Let us make men in our own image.” And took they some words and swagger and attitude and nuking shit tests, and formed they men; and breathed into their nostrils the breath of cocky-funny, and they created men.
And alpha placed men into the world and told them to dress and keep it; and they did.
And alpha looked upon the men, and said “It is not good for the Men to be alone. I will make him a companion and a helper.” And alpha caused the man to become drunk with wine, and caused him to fall into a deep slumber, and while he was out cold, alpha created women of all shapes and sizes, colors and hair styles. And alpha presented the females to the men, and they said “Whoa, man!” And so this is how women were named, and it is so to this very day.
And the men and the women were together. And alpha looked upon them and said, be fruitful, bang, and multiply. And they did, with great gusto and enthusiasm.
And one day the women were walking in the garden, and a serpent with the face of Betty Friedan slithered up to them, and said; “Did alpha really say to you never to eat the fruit of the Tree of the Knowledge of Feminine Mystique? For he knows that in the day you eat of it, you will become like alpha and men, knowing men and women.”
And the women did eat, and they found that it was pleasant to the taste. And then they offered some to their men; and the men said “but alpha told us never to eat from the Tree. What is this you have done?” And the women said “The Friedanosaurus offered the fruit to me, and I ate, and it was good.” And the men ate.
And then alpha saw the men and said “where are you? what have you done?” And the men answered “We were hiding, because you said not to eat of the Tree of the Knowledge of Feminine Mystique, But the women, whom you gave to us, they tasted the fruit, and gave it to us, and we also ate.”
And alpha said to the men: “Because of this thing you have done, cursed is the ground you will walk on. You will no longer be able to pass shit tests. You will become beta pussyboys. No longer will you be permitted to tend the world; for the women whom I gave you have taken it from you. Your women will become unhaaaaaaappy and will divorce you or marry you nevermore.”
And to the women alpha said: “From this day on you will be miserably unhappy, for there are none to lead you and tell you no. You will do what is right in your own eyes, and satisfaction you shall never know all the days of your lives.”
THE EXODUS AND THE PROPHETS
But came then the prophets, and they were named Ross Jeffries, David DeAngelo, Mystery, and Neil Strauss. And they foretold of a saviour. They told of the way to the woman’s heart and mind. And they did many signs and wonders with women in the taverns and the bar bathrooms and the meeting places and the bedrooms of the land.
And they wrote down the words which the alpha did give them, and it was “The Game”. And “The Game” was read by many men, who marveled at the words that were written, and said “who are these men that even the women spread their legs for them?”
THE GOSPEL OF ROISSY
And the time came for the saviour to come. And he was indeed brought forth, in the City of George and Abraham and Ronaldus Maximus, and alpha decreed that he should be called Roissy. And in the City of George, Roissy began a blog. And men began to hear of the Man Roissy; and they said “Rejoice, for unto us this day has been given in the City of Ronaldus Maximus a guru, who is Roissy the PUA.”
And so it was that Roissy began his public ministry.
And Roissy ascended to the top of Mons Veneris, and took he with him his wives and concubines. And he was absent for a time. And when he returned, written with the finger of alpha and inscribed in pixels on the Blog were the Law, given by alpha, the Sixteen Commandments of Poon. And Roissy gave the Law and the Commandments to the men; and he commanded them: “You shall learn these words and the Law and the Commandments which alpha and which I have this day given to you. You shall write them in your minds, and you shall learn them when you rise up and when you lie down; you shall know them when you eat and when you walk by the way; and you shall teach them to your sons and daughters; and you shall keep them in your mind forever.
“And you shall put these Commandments which I have this day given you into practice. Every day you shall do them, and take care to see that you keep them in spirit and in letter.
“And if you do these things which I have commanded you; then I will bless you with more sex from your women than you can shake a stick at. But if you do not do these things which I have this day commanded you, then woe be unto you men and your sons and your sons’ sons, even to the third and fourth generation; for I have given to you the Law and the Commandments for you and for your good. If my men will turn from their beta ways and will follow my Law and Commandments, then will alpha come to give advice, and will heal your relationships and marriages.”
And Roissy went into his wives and concubines, and he knew them, some more than once in a night. And Roissy came, and came, and came again, and he had many sons and daughters. And these are the sons and daughters of Roissy:
Dalrock of the Metroplex, who brought forth the Doctrine of Serial Monogamy and the Lovestruck Principle, and who sought to bestow marriage and monogamy upon his tribe; and the Dalrock also brought forth many charts and graphs and learned treatises with which to teach his sons and daughters;
Roosh V of the City of Ronaldus Maximus; (also known as the son whom Roissy loved), whose words and deeds are written in the Chronicles of Bang
Keoni of Kamehameha, who brought forth Married Game; and Keoni begat his son Athol the Kiwi who then begat MarriedManSexLife
Rollo Tomassi of the Land of Sunshine, who said “let us reason together” and brought forth The Rational Male
dannyfrom504, the one who said “If I can slay the poon, anyone can”, and he became a great Teacher and was renowned throughout the land
Vox the Genius, who wrote of the men, the politics and the Game
The Badger, who became a scrivener and thinker
The Private Man, the oldest of Roissy’s sons, promoting Charisma “for men of a certain age”
Stingray, who wrote of the true condition
SunshineMary, who taught the women about the Law
And Roissy had many many more sons and daughters who are counted like grains of sand on the beach and stars in the sky.
And Roissy’s sons and daughters themselves had many sons and daughters, each of them talking to one another and learning from one another.
THE ASCENSION OF ROISSY
And Roissy gathered his sons and daughters unto him. And Roissy said to them “you will not always have me with you; for soon I will return to alpha. It is good that I will go, because if I do not go, the Manosphere will not come. But when I go, I will send the Manosphere. It will guide you into the facts of male female relationships. It will remind you of all I have taught you. It will comfort you and cause you to waste endless hours in front of a screen learning of men and woman.
“Remember that the world, and many female bloggers with chips on their shoulders, hated me; and they will also hate you. If you suffer for Game’s sake, remember that I am with you. And remember that neither shit tests, nor breakups, nor flaking, nor snowflaking, nor batshit crazy, can ever keep you from your confident and dominant frames.
“But you have seen that which I have done, and read the words I have written unto you and given unto you. And I tell you that these and greater things all of you will do, for the sake of male female love, long lasting marriages, and intact families. I tell you that you will write greater and more insightful things than I, and the Game will reach even to the ends of the earth.
“But this I command you: Go forth and tell all the world of the good news. Go forth and make disciples of the Manosphere. Go forth and teach them all that I have taught you.”
And they saw Roissy ascend to Mons Veneris from whence he came; and they marveled at his words and what they had seen. And they resolved to minister to the beta, the omega, and the feminists who suffered for lack of good relationships and good sex. And they taught the men and women of all that Roissy had said, and of the Law and the Commandments; and many were saved from unhaaaaappy marriages and sluthood and involuntary celibacy.
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What you are missing so badly is the actual redemption, truth, and healing of Jesus Christ, Tomassi. You all are forever trying to rewrite scripture, you try so hard to bend it all around game, and your spirits just cry out for Him, for healing. It’s heartbreaking to watch.
There is one Savior and one only.
Spare a moment and give some thought to Jason M. Berlin, Jonas Issac Dick, and Alexander Markham Smith, will you? Elliot Rodgers and all the other Lost Boys. They deserved so much better.
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Neither myself or Vox or Dal or Don have any contention with religion. All we do is hold up a mirror for the church to see how they’re complicit in creating Beta men defeated by the same feminism and Feminine Imperative that’s been saturated into you and your churches culture for 5 generations now.
For every Jason Berlin there are thousands of men who’ve saved their own lives because they became Red Pill aware and applied it in their lives. Some used it to hook up with women they’d never had access to before and some have saved their Christian marriages. What you hate to confront is that the Red Pill is like fire, you can use it to heat your home and cook your food, or you can use it to burn down your neighbor’s house. What you really hate is the truth that the Red Pill awakens men to.
I get that the common Christian tact is to say an honest prayer of forgiveness and make a transformation, but how many men say the magic words and still find themselves stuck because church culture still keeps him deliberately blind to fundamental truths about men and women? The Red Pill and Christianity aren’t incompatible, and that’s what really frightens you. How men choose to apply it in their lives may or may not be, but the issue isn’t the Red Pill for you it’s what you and your dedication to the Feminine Imperative that it challenges. That’s why you hate Dal and Vox. You really have no valid counterargument to the facts and stats they present, so you have to fallback on convenient scripture to squid ink your way around the fact that the church has been largely impotent in helping men; and in fact has no real answers for, or appeal to men looking for truth.
Now, I know you’ll say “well ‘real’ Christianity has all the answers” and as a Christ-follower myself I’d agree, but yet here we are and still there’s nothing being offered to awaken men, and in fact, the church does more to drive men out and away than anything resembling outreach.
Tell me how the church would’ve saved Eliot Rodger? Do you even know what the kid was about? Did you even read his manifesto? Probably not, but I have, I even opined about it here when the shooting went down:
https://therationalmale.com/2014/05/27/the-severing/
What’s the church doing to help guys like Alex? Nothing, because they’re too busy berating men from the pulpit on Father’s Day, they’re too busy with women’s ministries. They wouldn’t have the first clue what to do and the men in pastoral positions are so cucked and Beta they’d have no frame of reference to have any legitimacy with anything they could come up with.
Thank your God tonight that there are guys like myself and Dalrock who are willing to have the hard conversations about TRP and Christianity and the corruption of the FI in the contemporary church.
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Tomassi, if you’re going to claim Christ’s name, than you are the church. You bring them in, you show them the way.
You aren’t having hard conversations. Neither is Dalrock or the others.
I don’t hate or fear anything about your ideology. I just grieve all the perpetual bitterness and collateral damage. There’s a better way.
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So how would you minister to Eliot Rodger? Tell him to go up for an alter call?
Tell him to pray harder for a girlfriend, then a wife so he could relieve his sexlessness? Pray real hard so he miraculously cures his Asperger’s Syndrome and social awkwardness?
Would you refer him to the youth pastor so he could introduce him to all the great Christian girls in the youth group? And when he’s socially shunned for being a creep will you tell him he’s not faithful enough?
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I would have taught him that he has worth and value as a man that goes far beyond his ability to score with women. I would have taught him how to see himself as Christ sees him, as having such worth and value, He gave His very life for him.
I would have told him that the world of human hierarchies is all wrong,that he belongs to a Kingdom where the first shall go last and the last shall go first.
But I never got to tell him any of those things, did I?
You could, Tomassi. You could speak life over the future Elliot Rodgers of the world and help them rewrite their whole narrative. They need to know Jesus Christ. Sex can be awesome, but sex is not Salvation.
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Eliot Rodger would’ve told you to go piss down a hole because none of that solve his most pressing problem – getting laid. His sense of worth was what his hormones were telling him he needed. Even “christian guys” are compelled by this:
https://therationalmale.com/2011/12/08/chasing-amy/
I keep telling you the Red Pill and religion are not incompatible, but accepting Christ isn’t going magically resolve guy’s misdirection, from the world or from the church, about intersexual dynamics.
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Tomassi, only Jesus Christ can save. Sex would not have saved Elli0t Rodgers, but some brotherly love might have given him half a chance.
Red pill and religion really are incompatible, at least when you insist on putting your red pill ideology before Jesus Christ Himself.
Listen to what you are saying, “His sense of worth was what his hormones were telling him ..”
And when your hormones are telling you to down a fifth? Shoot up some heroin? Snort some meth?
We always try to pour things into the abyss of our souls, sex, food, drugs, power, wealth, but none of those things satisfy, they just leave us emptier than ever.
I know you can’t hear yourself,but what you’re really saying is that only women can save, lots and lots of women. We just aren’t Salvation Tomassi, we can’t cure what ails men and we can’t save them.
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Salvation isn’t a magic wand, and being a Christian doesn’t excuse you from thinking critically.
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Salvation is a far more effective “magic wand” than believing sex is the cure for everything that ails us. It doesn’t end with Salvation Tomassi, it only begins there, and than you build a relationship and you grow spiritually. There is such healing to be found and redemption, grace. He is the lover of our souls and that is something we can never get in the physical. He changes everything and it really isn’t “magic” at all. God is real and He’s been transforming people for thousands of years.
One doesn’t become a Christian and stop thinking critically, one becomes a Christian and starts to think critically. All that self tends to just blind us and cloud our judgment. We are far more likely to be able to think critically when we are in a relationship with the Creator of the universe, than when we are on our own.
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Red pill and Christianity are incompatible because one is based on love, the other is based on sexuality and reason. You say that Eliot Rodgers most pressing problem is scoring with women. Is that what Jesus would’ve said? I don’t think so. Jesus would have done many of the things you sneared at, pray over him, tell him about love and salvation.
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Rollo, excuse me, are you Christian? Do you claim to know Jesus Christ? I’ve read some of your writings, including these replies, and all I see is non-biblical principles like game. I see a lot of focus on the sexuality of women, that women choose their mates based on social strata and sexual dominance. Given that your books are called the Rational Male, can I assume that they are based on Reason? God tells us to be wary of man’s wisdom which is contrary to the wisdom of God. The Bible tells men how to treat their wives, with sacrificial love, affection and high esteem. I have watched first hand as Feminism has destroyed women; the red pill followers are doing the same thing to men. How about if we follow the Spirit of Jesus Christ and the Bible? Those alone are the source of truth, wisdom, and true sources of how people should behave toward one another.
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Does anybody doubt that Game is a cult after reading that?
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@ r.t.
Apologies for engaging, but you brought it up, perhaps you can state WHAT exactly a Christian is………since you have said what one isn’t.
And do be somewhat careful as to origin, purpose, responsibility, and destiny of such an answer.
Btw, others are interested to hear this also; don’t be so quick to shrug it off as irrelevant..
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I don’t consider this man a Christian, particularly after his barbaric re-writing of the biblical story. I read some of his stuff on the Rational Male and it is so misogynistic, I want to throw up (read his response to BGR about keeping a wife in a state of uncertainty). Some of the others claim to be Christian, but they are missing the mark. The mark is Jesus, and all the other scriptures about obedience, submission, gender roles flows from His Spirit. If you can read Ephesians 5, and come away with the idea that the husband is not supposed to love his wife in a caring, loving, self-sacrificing manner, then you have missed it. Jesus saw HIs Bride as a prize, as the greatest gift He could give to Himself, as something to be nurtured and cherished. I loathe feminism and what it has done, but I also understand that this raw, violent, masculinity that wants to rob a woman of lovingkindness is antithetical to the love Jesus has for His people. And loving one’s wife is an unconditional command as much as submission to a husband is.
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As a young woman studying in the largely male-dominated field of engineering, I have many male friends from a variety of backgrounds and I can tell you right now, sex is NOT the cure to what ails them.
One of my friends is probably what you might call an “alpha male.” He has had many girlfriends, and although he has a stable relationship with his current girlfriend, it’s not like he doesn’t suffer from depression anymore. It’s not like he doesn’t still have fears, doubts, insecurities. It’s not like he isn’t still impacted by the abandonment of his father when he was younger. His girlfriend – as sweet and amiable and affectionate as I know she is, is not enough to heal him and make him feel completely happy. It is not possible to derive all of our happiness from another human being as imperfect and flawed as we are. True love and human satisfaction can only come from a Higher Source.
I could go on and on about the sadness I see in the hook-up culture around me, how devastating it is for the young ladies involved and how ultimately unfulfilling it is for the young men. How can it seem at all rational that the sum of human happiness revolves around sex?
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Whatever the intend was here, this is pure blasphemy. I’m sorry someone would think it appropriate to twist God’s words so heinously. This is . . . tragic. How could anyone whose heart is bent toward God, write such things? I don’t see it.
Becky
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Blasphemy = whatever you don’t have a cogent counterargument for.
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Rollo, that’s sad because I think you really believe it. You don’t understand that when you misuse God’s inspired words, when you twist His words it’s a sacrilege. You don’t seem to have a sense of offending a Holy God.
I don’t know you, so I don’t know if you profess belief in Jesus Christ or not, but it seems clear that you don’t hold God’s word in high regard. That’s the source of all that we know to be true spiritually. I can see why there’s an impasse between you and people like IB who views the relationship between men and women through the lens of the Bible. You don’t apparently care what the Bible says, so why should you use it as a guide to how men and women are to relate?
Why should you use it for anything, but to mock and twist and remake the world the way you wish it were.
I can’t help it—that’s simply sad.
Becky
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Would echo Pastor Randy’s comment about the necessity of John Eldredge’s interpretation of Christian masculinity, with one add-on: Eldredge also remarks that a Christian man is tuned into God and his word, receiving his cues and strength from that source of truth. Otherwise men are just a bunch of loose cannons.
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After some of these responses… I may change my name to undecided lol.
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When a society starts breaking down at any level, the thing to do is look to the past and what was being done differently that kept the breakdown from happening—then fix the problem. Our culture tries to pretend that breakdowns in gender paradigms are a ‘new normal’, when in reality, they are ‘abnormal’. Game/PUA is just another Abnormal trying to pose as a reaction to other Abnormal social trends.
The Red Pill is not an advance in Civilization; it is essentially a throwback to prehistoric times when Man was (according to some theories) one step removed from the Ape. If we examine how lower mammals live and interact, it’s exactly like Game: the dominant/Alpha male simply breeds with his harem of females and pushes the lower males out of the herd. It’s an insult to any religion to say that Man was created in the Image of God and then teach that his morals are no different from cattle. Men should strive to be worthy of their Creator and that means protecting and loving a community, church, and/or family.
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Amen, I was telling my son that very thing. He is into this PUA thing, and I was trying to explain the Red PIll philosophy to him. I compared it to the old picture of a caveman wanting to take a woman by the hair and drag her along or throw her over his shoulder.
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I kind of lost the comment architecture so I’m not sure if this will be seen. But then again a story as complex as Elliot Rodger’s isn’t really about whether he was having sex or not, or his obsession with sex or with his lack of it. And it isn’t just about the church or lack of the church either, although God can certainly help and heal anyone and the local church could certainly play a part in that if it were functioning as it is supposed to, although sadly there are many that are not.
That story is a whole tangled mess of toxicity and dysfunction and mental and physiological health factors that shouldn’t really be oversimplified like that. I guess if I was going to pick at a thread of that mess I might pick the pharmaceutical issues he suffered from. And since I have experience with how we screw with our nervous system’s and our endocrine systems to our own detriment in our current medical culture I guess I’m as able to speak to that as anyone. Or I might pick at the parenting. I’m experienced with raising a son with asperger’s as well. Parenting in our culture is certainly as badly screwed up as our willingness to tinker with our body’s chemical balance and trying tonparent someone who is wired differently than the “norm” is about a thousand times more heartbreaking because the child can’t consistently respond in the way other children will to discipline but not teaching them real discipline is still just as bad for them as it is for any other child.
I don’t know. For all we’ve made some missteps with mess in our lives with both medications (with some serious consequences sometimes) and with parenting (with plenty of guilt and grief to go with those) and for all my husband of the last twenty years was close to no help at all as a dad and was a very destructive force in my son’s life to the point that my son quite literally hates him with a vengeance, my son is now married with two children of his own and is far better to his wife and kids than I’d ever be able to describe. The two of them are both not really neuro-typical or so it appears to me. I worry about them a lot. But no matter what other worries I have for them I’m thrilled that they love each other and are good to each other and that I see regular evidence of it. My daughter-in-law gave me a pendant for Christmas that says “thank you for raising the man of my dreams.”
God truly can help and heal anything, even in this screwed up mess of a broken world full of so many users and abusers. So I’ll just keep praying for them to become more functional in the ways that they need and being thankful that they are happy and good to each other both emotionally and sexually rather than just one way or the other.
We are all whole humans. We all have complex needs. And pulling out just one string from our tangled messes to make one need or one desire the idol of your life will never work.
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“His sense of worth was what his hormones were telling him ..”
Seriously, imagine a woman using that line to excuse her slutiness or PMS — “my hormones make me who I am”. They love ganging up on women who take actions based on feeeeeelings, but a man taking action because of hormooooones….well that’s just normal. Its really more what the culture is telling men and women…that men need to be alpha studs and women “hot fucks” and if you are a virgin man or woman life just sucks.
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Rollo’s screed was very illustrative of the manosphere’s problem: Eros, not Christ, is their all in all.
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“Way back when, it all began with pick up artistry, puas, and the way they merged into the Mens Rights Movement.”
You had better have citations for that because as someone that’s an MRA I can tell you that NEVER HAPPENED. In fact PUA’s seemed to be almost willfully blind and ignorant to the risks they were taking around women and was the #1 reason I went MGTOW
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I advocate leaving American Woman alone and going elsewhere. After all it’s a global market now. https://elevenoneoneblog.wordpress.com
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I understand that men consider the American woman not subservient enough. You 1)don’t appear to be a Christian and 2)men look overseas because what they are really looking for is a slave, sexual or otherwise.
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No American men consider women nuts and crooked as hell and liars.
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Generalities are generally false. Not all women are like that.
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But didn’t you just generalize that all foreign women are more submissive than American Woman. Lmfao
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I thought that was what you were implying by showing off foreign women.
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First you tell me not to generalize about American women/Western Women while you generalize about expats you have never met. Men here is why you should avoid western women. https://www.yahoo.com/style/woman-unhappy-small-1671-engagement-ring-gets-slammed-online-162440586.html
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I’m not concerned about men and their failures with women. The conditions of women in Asia are well documented. Men marry them for the same reason NGOs go to the third world….labor is cheaper there and not subject to labor laws. Women in the former Soviet Union are looking to come to America. I don’t see expatriates as any kind of issue. If men are moving out of America just so they can find women, then they are doing so for the reasons stated above. The internet is also replete with American women looking for alternatives to Feminsm. In my writing about BIBLICAL submission, I have come across many women looking for the right form of marriage. I have plenty of proof that American women are not all crooked and liars, and I doubt that all secular women are either. No, you just want to blame American women because they won’t allow men to treat them like dogs.
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PS the US census has now tracked the data of thos that marry foreign spouses. 85% Success rate with girls from the FSU, and 70% for China and Southeast Asian. 25% with Western women.
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Well, your idea of success rate is a slave. Men who look for foreign wives are looking for women who are willing to slave for a man. Women in Asian countries are used to working extremely hard, sometimes being sold into prostitution. They are used to being treated like dogs so they are willing to accept the crumbs from the table. American women are not willing to be treated like sex objects. Not sure what FSU is. Aside from that, this isn’t looking at it from a Christian viewpoint.
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No, men are looking for women who respect their men and the instution of marriage. Oh 2 of the men are househusbands. You make all these assumptions for men you have never met. Game over you lost. And trying to shame men back into the plantation. You utterly failed.
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You make a lot of assumptions about American women being crooked. Not all are playing a game. Not sure what you are referring to with househusbands. If you mean your friends, that’s only 2 out of how many? And I’m not referring to just your friends. Why would a man seek a wife overseas among Asian women if they could have a submissive wife here? Because they don’t just want submission. They are looking for women who are used to their men being overly dominant and controlling and Asian women as I have stated are used to extreme slavery, so they would be accepting of anything an American man gave them. That doesn’t make it right. There’s nothing wrong with international marriages per se, but when you say all American women are crooked and liars, that is 1)a generality, because I know plenty of submissive wives here in America, and 2)possibly looking for something beyond submission,
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Do you honestly think that those women whose pictures you are looking at are honestly looking for a serious relationship? Most of them are looking for some sugar daddy to bring them to America so they can have the same things we have.
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I am already married and I don’t live in the US, but 20 out of my 22 closest friends are married to an expat and they have all been married longer than 8 years. The Average length of an American marriage.
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Elevenoneoneblog: I’m going to discontinue this conversation for one big reason. It’s not going anywhere. I am looking at the issues from a biblical standpoint that benefits men AND women. Asian women and FSU women need Jesus Christ. End of story.
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